Oldest PC still in use

[carlsson]

Intel and HP recently held a contest in Dutch IT weeky magazine "Computable", and found a winner at PHI DATA still using their 8088-based IBM 5160 (1983) for testing matrix printers. As The Register mentions, Dell ran a similar contest a few years ago in the USA and found an Altair 8800 still in business use.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/67/34933.html

Some readers' comments:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/35/34957.html

I wonder if it counts if one starts a business running on old computers, or if it has to have run since the computer still was modern.

[Erik]

I'm sure I could set up my 8800 to run some sort of "business" application and "win" a contest like this. . . I'm just not sure what I'd do or why. :)

The 8800 would probably be the oldest PC class machine but I'm sure there are still businessess running older mini and mainframe gear. Someone somewhere has to still be using an early IBM 360, for instance.

Erik

[dongfeng]

My Dad's company ran a 1978 Olivetti BCS2030 until 1996/7 :)

It kept catching on fire, so was proven to be too costly to keep running :lol:

[carlsson]

"It kept catching on fire" - was it powered by coal?

BTW, haven't these old IBM 360 etc been constantly migrated onto new technology (IBM 390?) during the years, so it would be difficult to tell which parts are original? I know much too less about these machines.

[CP/M User]

"Erik" wrote:

> I'm sure I could set up my 8800 to run some sort
> of "business" application and "win" a contest like
> this. . . I'm just not sure what I'd do or why. :)

> The 8800 would probably be the oldest PC class
> machine but I'm sure there are still businessess
> running older mini and mainframe gear. Someone
> somewhere has to still be using an early IBM 360,
> for instance.

Does an Abacus still qualify?

Cheers,
CP/M User.

[dongfeng]

"It kept catching on fire" - was it powered by coal?

:lol:

It kept burning out some of the boards inside... it would have been too much work to re-computerise all of the existing records at the time, so they just kept repairing it!

http://www.howard81.co.uk/upload/vcf/olivetti.jpg

[CP/M User]

"dongfeng" wrote:

>> "It kept catching on fire" - was it powered by coal?

> It kept burning out some of the boards inside... it
> would have been too much work to re-computerise
> all of the existing records at the time, so they just
> kept repairing it!

I'd say it caught fire through of lack of ventelation(?),
wouldn't you say?

Cheers,
CP/M User.

[dongfeng]

It was in the same spot from 1978-1996... I think it was just old :)

[CP/M User]

"dongfeng" wrote:

> It was in the same spot from
> 1978-1996... I think it was just old :)

Well, it's a bit hard to see from that
picture you've sent in, but by just
looking at that metal casing around
it, I though that perhaps it was
overheating inside (you did mention
that it's happened a couple of times),
Though, I've only heard of cases where
something old has packed it in because
something in it gave way, but not to the
point where it's caught on fire or set
a fire, well no really I'm lieing I've
heard of electrical faults from other
household applicanses, like TVs (which
is a good one), but computer based
doesn't seem to ring any bells. Which
is why I felt that ventelation was an
issue.

Cheers,
CP/M User.

[frozenfire75i]

I wonder if anything like this has been done since?



Intel and HP recently held a contest in Dutch IT weeky magazine "Computable", and found a winner at PHI DATA still using their 8088-based IBM 5160 (1983) for testing matrix printers. As The Register mentions, Dell ran a similar contest a few years ago in the USA and found an Altair 8800 still in business use.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/67/34933.html

Some readers' comments:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/35/34957.html

I wonder if it counts if one starts a business running on old computers, or if it has to have run since the computer still was modern.

[Ole Juul]

The fact is that there are still a few businessmen who eschew fashion and take a pragmatic approach. It doesn't take much to keep inventory, or write invoices. I have a friend who has plenty of modern computer power for browsing, the kids use, etc, who runs lotus on a 286 for his business. He likes it because it works well.
I'm just waiting for the day when he hands the Tax Dept a 5 1/4" floppy. lol

[Chuck(G)]

You see a lot of old computing hardware attached to machine tools and embroidery machines. The iron cost a lot, still works fine, so it pays to keep using the old gear.

I suspect that there are still some old Sun Engine analyzers out there still chugging away on their National IMP-16 CPUs.

And DEC PDP-8s can still be found in active use here and there.

[Jorg]

I think there still must be a lot of old machines in function in laboratories, running proprietary software.

I know at least one mechanical testing setup that still uses an Apple II for calculating and outputting test results.

[carlsson]

Perhaps it should be limited to the oldest personal computer (i.e. no IBM/360, PDP-8 or so on) still actually used as a such. Automated control of some machinery is not a typical PC - office - application.

[Jorg]

Hmm, well, calling a PDP a personal computer, I don't know..

But I get what you mean :)

[Unknown_K]

I think you are better of with old machines for many tasks.

1. Keeps workers from browsing the web and loading games onto test rigs.
2. You don't have software glitches or timing problems because the code used runs too fast on a new machine.
3. You never have overheating issues on old hardware because it doesn't run very hot.
4. Nobody wants to walk off with an XT while a newer laptop doing the same work will get stolen (had that happen at work in the middle of a data aquisition test).
5. IT doesn't want anything to do with the old stuff so they won't take it and break it.

[frozenfire75i]

at one time someone told me that 5150 are still in use doing something for the weather and data collection, I don't know if that has any truth to it.

[linemanduke]

i just saw a ibm 5160 being used at the dentist today, they use it to keep an inventory of medical records. rest of the computers are just plain ole ctx 386 systems weird thing is they started practice in 1996.

[Ole Juul]

i just saw a ibm 5160 being used at the dentist today, they use it to keep an inventory of medical records. rest of the computers are just plain ole ctx 386 systems weird thing is they started practice in 1996.
Envite him to the forum!

[patscc]

Or offer to swap him the 5160 for a brand-spankin' used post-486 box, and take the 5160 off his hands.
patscc

[Unknown_K]

i just saw a ibm 5160 being used at the dentist today, they use it to keep an inventory of medical records. rest of the computers are just plain ole ctx 386 systems weird thing is they started practice in 1996.

I would think they have a custom coded paid for application that cannot run on anything faster then a 286. They might have started practice in 1996 but took over an older practice from somebody retiring or who went bankrupt.

Thing is if the system works, why bother upgrading to something that might not.

[cosam]

And DEC PDP-8s can still be found in active use here and there.
Yep, I understand there are plenty left running production lines and other such industrial processes. I have a PDP-11/35 (built in 1973) that was running in production until a little under a year ago - it was only retired because the product the company were testing with it went end-of-life. I wonder how many modern machines will still be running 35 years from now!

[pontus]

Yep, I understand there are plenty left running production lines and other such industrial processes. I have a PDP-11/35 (built in 1973) that was running in production until a little under a year ago - it was only retired because the product the company were testing with it went end-of-life. I wonder how many modern machines will still be running 35 years from now!

I have a PDP-11/44 inbound that was in production last year. The PDP-8 is probably not as common, but I've heard rumours about them being out there. Sort of makes you happy

[Unknown_K]

One company I worked at used an old IBM XT to test serial ports on a temperature controller up to the time I left in 1999.

[lenegade]

I imagine it's possible to find a few people using Tandy Model 100's for data collection and such, Rick Hansen at Club 100 would know some I should think.

[tezza]

It's also quite likely that a number of people are using old software to do what needs to be done, but in emulation (e.g. Virtual PC 2007 etc).

Good emulators are a way to run legacy software but on reliable hardware.

Tez

[TandyMan100]

I imagine it's possible to find a few people using Tandy Model 100's for data collection and such, Rick Hansen at Club 100 would know some I should think.
Hello! Over here! Look at me! Hi!

lawlz

There's a group of about a hundered of us who use the 100 on a semi-daily basis, and LOVE it.

[Chuck(G)]

Do you mean PC = IBM 5150 family?

If not, I suspect that there's probably an S100 or Multibus box around somewhere still ticking away. Heaven knows, you can still find old gear running CNC and embroidery equipment...

[Druid6900]

I'm using a DataTrain 1000 to test 8-bit cards and hard drives every day and a DataTrain 2112 to test 16-bit cards and hard drives everyday.

[Chuck(G)]

A couple of years ago, I ran into a customer with a Mitsubishi Multi-16 to control some piece of shop equipment. I told him that if he ever decided to jettison it, to give me a call.

I'm not waiting with bated breath for the telephone to ring, however.

Multi-16s are very uncommon this side of the Pacific and are sought after in Japan by collectors.

[carlsson]

Do you mean PC = IBM 5150 family?
According to the original message I wrote in January 2004 (soon six years ago!), at least Dell counts an Altair 8800 as a PC. But as mentioned already six years ago, there could be even older gear still in production use.

[Chuck(G)]

According to the original message I wrote in January 2004 (soon six years ago!), at least Dell counts an Altair 8800 as a PC. But as mentioned already six years ago, there could be even older gear still in production use.

Hey, if you leave the general-interest threads active, you'll get a response every few years. :)

I don't think anyone but the most hard-bitten DEC freak would call a PDP-8 a "PC". So maybe the Altair 8800 is the far end of the spectrum, though it hardly seems rugged enough to survive in an industrial setting.

[carlsson]

I suppose it could be used in an office too, although newer technology tends to adopt easier in offices than in industrial use where a PC may be used to control expensive machinery which is practically or financially impossible to replace. As the article mentions, one Dutch company claimed to still doing their accounting on a 1980's PC but of course it could be a 1987 PS/2 or something equally new.

I wonder how many companies will still run some business software on a 1.7 GHz Pentium 4 and Windows XP in the year 2030. It is far from unthinkable, as long as the hardware survives another 20 years.

[Chuck(G)]

I wonder how many companies will still run some business software on a 1.7 GHz Pentium 4 and Windows XP in the year 2030. It is far from unthinkable, as long as the hardware survives another 20 years.

I wish I had your faith in the survival of today's electronics. When perusing new offerings I usually get discouraged at the amount of cheap junk being peddled. In principle, there's no reason that a 5160 couldn't be run for 40 years, as long as the hard disk holds up. And given my experience with modern hard drives (1TB+), I would expect a Quantum Q540 to last longer than the latest-and-greatest offering from Seagate.

[Starshadow]

About two years ago I sold My Commodore 64 and Apple IIc not to another collector, but to a horse ranch that uses the machines to calculate dosing of some sort for their horses. They wanted just the C64 at first, but they saw the IIc and asked if it will run the same programs the IIe's will. When I said yes they grabbed another disk and it was the same program, but for the Apple, so unless they upgraded, My fully restored Apple IIc and C64 are still in service with their new purpose.

[Bungo Pony]

When I left my job last year, I was busy creating a backup machine in case the old PC clone from 1985 ever died. The machine is used for testing circuit boards that were designed and built for the Hydro company. The boards were designed in 1985 and occasionally had to be 'modernized' because of obsolete parts. Hydro kept using them because modern PLC technology kept getting outdated too quickly and was less reliable than those old boards.

I went to a used computer place about a year ago and got into some great conversation with one of the guys who worked there. Apparently, there are people (Hutterites) with their own colonies that buy C-64s fairly often. They had someone program up a cartridge with custom software, and they keep using it. Everytime a C-64 burns out, they go and buy another one.